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Re: Lost my newsgroups

Roy Schestowitz <newsgroups@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> __/ [ John Bokma ] on Friday 19 May 2006 21:35 \__

[ .. ]

> Not true, if implemented properly. There's this programming trick
> where you build your data aside and only link to it (or exchange old
> data with it) once it's complete. You then find yourself in a scenario
> where a single CPU cycle may suffice.

We're talking about file storage. Not about memory.

> With 2GHz processors (2 billion
> per second), the likelikelihood of a loss is so small that it is
> utterly negligible. 

Again mistaken, your main memory doesn't run on 2GHz.

Like I said, file corruption *does* happen. There is always a moment 
that it's in between.

>> Moreover, have you ever studied the history format of Firefox, to
>> name one Open Source application? If you understand it, you are
>> invited by many people to document it.
> If there is a plug-in hook for history, then it can't be difficult to
> write something that dumps the data in a reasonable fashion.

Instead of guessing, read about the issue:


In case you don't know who jwz is, read:

>> While you're looking at it, check the other files as well. Clear?
>> Document it :-)
> Actually, data in Firefox and Thunderbird (to name 2 JRE apps from
> Mozilla) is retained in a simplistic form (RSSOwl likewise, XML
> primarily).

It's not the case for the history file, which uses a nightmare format. 
There is a reason why it's finally going to be replaced.

> I sometimes edit the JavaScript files to make use of
> hidden options. There is some more stuff in chrome, like which allows
> you to specify a global CSS modifier, which I personally use to nuke
> advertisements.

Yes, that's like editing a signature file for OE.

>> Finally, Thunderbird had recently a bug that lost a bit too much data
>> when compacting folders. You might say: ah, well, the mail box is
>> just a text file. But can my mom fix it?
> I once had to restore my Thunderbird folders from backup. I was
> transferring big heaps of mail while having very little free space on
> my hard-drive. Frankly, I should have been warned about this exception
> (which I did), but _without_ data loss.

It isn't about you not losing data, it's about other people having 
several issues with Thunderbird *losing* data. And in case you have 
missed it, in Firefox 2 an extremely long outstanding bug finally has 
been recognized and fixed: random lost of clip board data. Very 

>> In short, for most users it doesn't matter if it's a text file, or a
>> binary file that they can decode by reading the source (Mork).
> I disagree.

Of course, since you have been advertising yourself here for quite some 
time as a GNU/Linux zealot who has little knowledge about and Windows XP 
and GNU/Linux

> XML is more readable than binary.

For the majority of users it's equal. Why are you so blind to see this 
simple fact?

> At worst of
> circumstances, you can read a fairly rhetorical XML file and put in
> the settings manually in another application that you migrate to.

So you never had a look at the other files in your profile directory of 
Firefox. Maybe you should do.

>> Doesn't matter. If you application crashes (or power outage) while
>> writing to disk, the file will be corrupt. And don't say that this is
>> not happening under Linux, because I have seen it there too.
> See rebuttal above.

Yes, which is flawed.

>> Just a request: next time you post a "GNU/Linux is better then
>> Windows XP" post, reread it carefully. Especially the parts you're
>> unsure about regarding to Windows, since most of the times your post
>> seem to be based on lack of knowledge of Windows XP and too much
>> trust in GNU/Linux. 
> I'm biased. *smile* I hope this doesn't annoy you. Honestly.

No, you are like most zealots, you have little understanding about both 
GNU/Linux, Open Source, and Windows XP. You take it personally, you 
consider OS a part of you and hence there can't be any flaw. One day you 
will see that you're wrong.

>> I have been using several operating systems in 20+ years, and all
>> have issues, and many of those issues are shared. The thing is, an
>> expert user rarely has any issues on any of those operating systems.
>> It's often the very inexperienced user that messes things up time
>> after time. Just read help post by inexeperienced GNU/Linux users,
>> and it doesn't sound that different from users at the same level with
>> any other OS. 
> Good point, John.

Yes, it's reality. I can't explain my mom to tweak an OE inbox file, nor 
can I explain her how to tweak an XML file. No matter that she should be 
able to read it with Notepad. It's both gibberish to her. And this holds 
for most users. Moreover, people who are able to fix an OE issue (I have 
done so), are the same people who have no problems with tweaking an XML 
file until it works. It wouldn't amaze me if this holds both ways.

>> The thing with Windows is that the user base that is at that level
>> makes all other OSes insignificant. But don't let that fool you
>> again. 
> Ubuntu is simpler to install and use from Windows, according to many.

Many other zealots, sure. Don't forget that you're talking about Ubuntu 
2006, and comparing it to Windows XP (2001). There is almost 5 years 
between those. The worse thing that's happening to GNU/Linux is that 
still people think that making it a clone of Windows, and mix some other 
stuff in, is the way to make something better. I like sugar in my coffee 
and milk, but I am not adding it to a glass of orange juice...

> But let's leave advocacy aside and make fun of Google instead...

Well, I see you doing it a lot, and its more zealotism to me. I doubt 
anyone "here" cares.

I gave up on the OS wars back in '96 or so. By that time I had heard it 
all: as soon as someone says A is better compared to B it means he 
ignores the flaws of A, and has little of no understanding of B. And, 
quite interesting more often then not, very little understanding of A as 

If you think the world will become a better place with GNU/Linux 
everywhere, you are very mistaken. It's not going to happen, for several 
reasons, the major one is that in technology it doesn't count what's 
best, but what sells the best. Maybe you think: no problem with 
GNU/Linux, nothing to sell. Again mistaken, there is a lot to sell, for 
starters support.

John                Experienced (web) developer: http://castleamber.com/

Firefox RSS:    http://johnbokma.com/firefox/rss-and-live-bookmarks.html

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