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[News] Mono Trap Explained, More Complaints Made

  • Subject: [News] Mono Trap Explained, More Complaints Made
  • From: Roy Schestowitz <newsgroups@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Sat, 19 Jun 2010 14:45:41 +0100
  • Followup-to: comp.os.linux.advocacy
  • Newsgroups: comp.os.linux.advocacy
  • User-agent: KNode/4.4.2
Hash: SHA1

"The last thing this company needs is another fucking [computer] language."

                                --Nathan Myhrvold, Microsoft

Watch Microsoft megatrolls monopolize Linux 

,----[ Quote ]
| Oh, and getting right back to the patent 
| question, Microsoft's covenant doesn't 
| specify patents by number. They simply state 
| that if they own and control a core dotnet 
| patent, you get a pass. As just pointed out, 
| this is a trap; however, note that you are 
| still on the hook for these core patents, as 
| Microsoft is free to sell these core mono 
| patents to someone (eg, one of Bill Gates' 
| or Nathan Myhrvold's patent troll 
| companies), who could then turn around and 
| sue the daylights out of potentially 
| arbitrarily simple mono programs.


Mono is a disease. Why spread it? 

,----[ Quote ]
| In case you don't already know about it, the 
| whole purpose of mono for Linux (hereafter 
| just mono) is simply to allow microsofts 
| self serving language and sub-standard net 
| protocols to work under Linux. This project 
| is hosted by Novell which entered into a 
| partnership with microsoft because they were 
| spooked by the whole license and litigation 
| saber rattling of a few years ago.
| Now c#, which is the programing language 
| mono supports, is what I call a claytons 
| language. You may not know what I mean so I 
| will explain. Claytons is a non-alcoholic 
| drink which mimics an alcoholic drink. It's 
| slogan is "The drink you have when you are 
| not having a drink". Which is what I think 
| about c#. It's the programing language you 
| have when you don't know a programing 
| language.
| Due to this matrimony between Novell and 
| microsoft, this mono, and its bed buddy 
| moonlight, have been spreading throughout 
| the Linux family. This has been causing me 
| some dis-ease. Linux advocates, even those 
| who purport to hate microsoft, have been 
| running around and willingly catching mono. 
| What they do not realise is that they are 
| contributing to microsofts success at the 
| expense of Linux.
| [...]
| In short, I think that mono is a disease 
| which infects Linux distributions and is not 
| much different than its biological viral 
| namesake. For that very reason I do not have 
| mono installed on any of my Linux 
| distributions. I do not even look at any 
| program or distribution which forces me to 
| install mono. For that matter I do not even 
| consider Novell products when thinking about 
| Linux. However, that is just me :)


MonoDevelop 2.4 released



Mono Tools for Visual Studio 2.0 Beta 1

,----[ Quote ]
| We are extremely happy to announce Mono Tools
| for Visual Studio 2.0 Beta 1! (MonoTools)
| Mono Tools for Visual Studio is a commercial
| add-in for Microsoft Visual Studio 2008 and
| Microsoft Visual Studio 2010 that enables
| developers to build, debug, and deploy .NET
| applications targeting Mono without leaving
| Visual Studio.


Microsoft has shot .NET ecosystem in foot: De Icaza

,----[ Quote ]
| Microsoft has shot the .NET ecosystem in
| the foot because of the constant threat of
| patent infringement that it has cast on the
| system, Novell vice-president and Microsoft
| MVP, Miguel de Icaza, is quoted as telling
| the website, Software Development Times,
| recently.
| Strangely, however, the article, headlined
| "Does Windows cost Microsoft
| opportunities", which contains these
| quotes, written by one of SD Times senior
| editors, David Worthington, has disappeared
| off the site. It shows up in a search but
| only yields a 404 when one clicks on the
| link that comes up in the search.
| The disappearance of this article was first
| spotted by Jason, who runs the the-
| source.com website.


De Icaza Says Microsoft Has Shot .NET Ecosystem In Foot


The Disappearing Article Mystery

,----[ Quote ]
| I know this will startle the Gentle Reader,
| but I actually try to check and verify
| stuff. Itâs how I pretend I have integrity.
| So I plugged the quote into Google and
| found a few references, all of which linked
| the SD Times article âDoes Windows cost
| Microsoft opportunites?â allegedly by David
| Worthington.
| Oh â donât bother with that last link. Itâs
| a 404. The article isnât in the list of
| articles by the author David Worthington as
| listed on the SD Times site either.
| Google cache has it though. It certainly
| appears like the story was out there, and
| was on SD Times, and contained the alleged
| quotes from Mr. de Icaza.
| The Question(s)
| Why is this article no longer up on SD
| Times?
| Are all the quotes attributed to Mr. de
| Icaza in the article genuine? (If they are
| I have more to say about some of them!)


Daily Dose - De Icaza Interview About .Net Taken Down

,----[ Quote ]
| In an article titled "Does Windows cost
| Microsoft opportunities" by the SD Times,
| Novell VP and Mono Project lead Miguel de
| Icaza had some strong opinions about
| Microsoft's handling of the .NET platform.
| For reasons unknown, the article has been
| taken down but is still available on
| Google's cache.  Here were some of the
| criticisms de Icaza had:  "Unlike the Java
| world that is blossoming with dozens of
| vibrant Java Virtual Machine
| implementations, the .NET world has
| suffered by this meme spread by [Microsoft
| CEO Steve Ballmer] that they would come
| after people that do not license patents
| from them.  Microsoft has shot the .NET
| ecosystem in the foot because of the
| constant threat of patent infringement that
| it has cast on the system."


SHOCKING: de Icaza likes oData

,----[ Quote ]
| Mr. de Icaza continues to fawn over /
| promote Microsoft technologies. I find it
| amusing and revealing at the same time that
| his infatuation isnât simply with COM or C#
| or .NET or Silverlight, but has over time
| come to be more and more fanboy-like.
| I donât recall any big blogs or tweets from
| Mr. de Icaza about gData â but Iâm sure I
| just missed them. But when it comes to
| Microsoftâs .NET-based knock-off, well then
| boy howdy thatâs an exciting topic for Team
| Mono!


Of Mono, apologists, and missing the news for the spin

,----[ Quote ]
| But what is extremely interesting about
| this whole episode is the way that Bruce
| Byfield, a self-described computer
| journalist, has gotten involved and tried
| to make out that there was nothing
| newsworthy about De Icaza's comments.
| Byfield attempted to turn the focus on the
| fact that Melton and others had questioned
| the disappearance of the March 17 article.
| He lumped a link to my iTWire piece in a
| portion of his article which had a sub-
| heading "The Rumor Mill Grinds Coarsely" -
| though everything reported in my piece was
| strictly factual - and, for good measure,
| also took aim at Roy Schestowitz who runs
| the BoycottNovell website. There is some
| history between Byfield and Schestowitz.
| In other words, Melton, I and Schestowitz
| comprised the rumour mill. The oracle of
| truth was apparently Byfield.
| [...]
| De Icaza begins the March 25 blog post by
| saying "It seems that David's article on
| Windows strategy tax on .NET lacked enough
| context for my actual quotes in there."
| But, as Melton, who, in truth, shows more
| of an analytical mind than both Byfield and
| De Icaza combined, points out, De Icaza had
| already congratulated Worthington on the
| article, posting a tweet: "@dcworthington I
| am in whole agreement with you there; Btw I
| loved the article, good balance."
| Let me echo Melton, who, in a long analysis
| of the episode, asked: "So did the article
| lack enough context or was it a good
| balance?" It surely can't be both!
| Byfield, of course, did not bother about
| minor contradictions like this. He was on a
| path to uncover the "The Mono Mystery That
| Wasn't" - that's the headline for his
| article, which makes it appear to be some
| kind of fairytale, as indeed it turns out
| to be.


How Mono apologists drive developers away

,----[ Quote ]
| When Hubert Figuiere, a developer who had
| lost his job with Novell in the first
| quarter of 2009, released the note-taking
| application Gnote on April 1 last year, one
| doubts that he had any idea about the kind
| of attacks which would be launched on him
| by Mono advocates and apologists.
| [...]
| Figuiere's sin? Gnote is a port of the
| note-taking application Tomboy, which is
| written in Mono and is an official part of
| the GNOME Desktop. Gnote is a port of the
| same code in C++/GTK.
| Mono, for those who are unaware, is an
| attempt by Miguel de Icaza, co-founder of
| the GNOME desktop project and a vice-
| president at Novell, to create an open
| source implementation of Microsoft's .NET
| development environment. Mono has attracted
| a fair share of controversy as many in FOSS
| circles fear that it may pose patent
| problems.


The Product of My Research


Telling it like it is, the Allison way

,----[ Quote ]
| He's the man with a conscience in the computer
| industry. Not too many of them around these
| days, an era when people attach the name "open
| source" to anything in a bid to attract funding.
| Never mind if the business in question is really
| not gving away source code.
| Jeremy Allison caused a stir in 2006 when he
| announced that he was leaving Novell because the
| company had signed a patent indemnification deal
| with Microsoft.
| One could well argue that someone with his
| reputation could easily do this, as he wouldn't
| have had a problem finding a job anywhere.
| But then, just tell those who raise this
| argument that a couple of gentlemen by the names
| of Miguel de Icaza and Nat Friedman stayed
| behind at Novell when Allison left and see how
| quickly silence prevails.


Mono and Samba: smell the difference, says Allison

,----[ Quote ]
| It may be recalled that Allison quit Novell in disgust
| soon after the company signed a patent indemnification
| deal with Microsoft in November 2006.
| [...]
| "Miguel's employer, Novell, has a patent agreement
| with Microsoft that exempts Mono users from Microsoft
| patent aggression, so long as you get Mono from
| Novell. Miguel takes pains to point this out," Allison
| wrote.
| As far as Mono goes, De Icaza has implemented parts of
| it which are not covered by the specifications
| submitted to the standards body ECMA by Microsoft; the
| parts submitted are said to be available on royalty-
| free terms and without fear of patent violations.


Consequences (If You Wait Long Enough)

,----[ Quote ]
| Monomania
| Jeremy Allison argues that Mono is dangerous
| to free software distributions and should be
| relegated to the "restricted" repositories
| along with other software with unsafe
| licensing and/or patent contexts. He makes
| rational arguments, avoids emotion and thus
| when he is inevitably dismissed with a hand-
| wave by the Monomaniacs like the rest of us it
| will be especially telling.


Mono a mano - Many of us are wrestling with this, I suspect

,----[ Quote ]
| Allison's contention is that while he can
| understand original Mono creator Miguel de
| Icaza's reasons for wanting to code GUI apps
| in C# rather than C or C++, Allison would
| rather that the open-source community turned
| to Java instead in its quest to build out the
| graphical environment. There is some talk
| about, at the time Mono was started, Java not
| being available under a free license, but
| Allison contends that it has more to do with
| potential or real rivalries among developers
| wishing to use Java or Mono/C++, as well as
| control over their respective projects.
| [...]
| On the other hand, seeing Mono as the "Miguel
| de Icaza-who-works-for-Novell Show," keeping
| in mind that I know little about him and have
| never met him, doesn't give me a good feeling
| about how GNOME is tipping every more closely
| into becoming a Mono-powered world.



,----[ Quote ]
| But the problem is that Mono is dangerous for
| Free Software. The heart of the matter is, as
| usual, software patents. Microsoft have patents
| on the technology inside .NET, and since the
| Tom Tom lawsuit, Microsoft have shown they are
| not averse to attacking Free Software using
| patent infringement claims. Microsoft have
| tried to allay some fears by putting the .NET
| specification under their "Microsoft Community
| Promise" which you can read here:
| http://www.microsoft.com/interop/cp/default.mspx
| Miguel hailed this a the solution to all the
| patent problems with Mono. But this promise is
| simply not good enough to base a language
| environment implementation upon. After all, if
| the rug is pulled out from under that
| implementation by the threat of patent
| infringement you don't just lose the
| implementation itself, you lose all the
| programs that depend upon it. That's a really
| dangerous situation for Free Software programs
| to be in. The Free Software Foundation wrote a
| good analysis of the problems with this promise
| here:
| http://www.fsf.org/news/2009-07-mscp-mono
| But my basic issue with the Microsoft Community
| Promise is that Miguel doesn't have to depend
| on it like everyone else does. Miguel's
| employer, Novell, has a patent agreement with
| Microsoft that exempts Mono users from
| Microsoft patent aggression, so long as you get
| Mono from Novell.
| [...]
| Microsoft isn't playing games any more by
| merely threatening to assert patents. Real
| lawsuits have now occurred and the gloves are
| off against Free Software. Moving Mono and its
| applications to the "restricted" repositories
| is now just plain common sense.


Mono is a trap â evidence

,----[ Quote ]
| Still arenât convinced that Mono is a trap
| which ultimately only benefits Microsoft?
| Take a look at this âHighly Confidentialâ
| document from Microsoft (from Comes vs
| Microsoft case) entitled âEffective Evangelismâ
| and decide for yourself. It exposes Microsoftâs
| game plan for dominating the market with their
| platforms (which we already know, but some
| choose to ignore).

Version: GnuPG v1.4.10 (GNU/Linux)


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