On Sat, 25 Oct 2008 11:24:51 GMT, Robin T Cox wrote:
> Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 20:34:56 GMT, Robin T Cox wrote:
>>
>>> Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 18:01:30 GMT, Robin T Cox wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Moshe Goldfarb. wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 16:55:16 GMT, Robin T Cox wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> China hacked off at Microsoft anti-piracy drive
>>>>>>
>>>>>> That says a lot about the lack of morals the Chinese people seem to
>>>>>> have. Oh well, considering their human rights record this should come
>>>>>> as no surprise.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Is it moral of big coporations like Microsoft to hit poor Chinese users
>>>>> on the head in this way in order to preserve their profits?
>>>>
>>>> Companies are in business to make a profit.
>>>> Stealing their works cuts into that profit and thus the shareholder's
>>>> profits as well.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Fair enough. But please don't give us lectures about morality. Or about
>>> stealing, when Microsoft steal advantage over poor and ignorant Chinese
>>> by pretending to offer them a square deal, when we all know that a square
>>> deal is the very last thing that Microsoft will offer them.
>>
>> What are you talking about?
>> Square deal?
>>
>> The product is for sale.
>> You either buy it or you don't.
>>
>> What are you talking about?
>>
>
> Please don't prevaricate.
>
>>
>>> And also don't give us lectures about stealing when Microsoft have always
>>> stolen their work from others.
>>
>> Whatever.
>> I knew that was coming because you guys can't have a single conversation
>> without interjecting something about Microsoft being satan.
>>
>
> Straw man. The word 'satan' was never mentioned by me.
>
>>
>>>> Linux is free.
>>>> They can use Linux if they want.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Of course, which is what we are here to proclaim, and it's refreshing to
>>> hear you endorse that message.
>>
>> So what's the problem?
>>
>
> No problem when you talk sense, as you are obviously capable of doing.
>
>>>> Sorry but your line of reasoning is, well, it's loony.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Not sorry, but I really think that you have ended up contradicting
>>> yourself.
>>
>>
>> No I haven't.
>> I have taken your argument apart, you just have not realized it yet.
>>
>> It's very simple:
>>
>> 1. Windows is a commercial product that comes with a licence.
>> 2. You are not forced to purchase it, espeicalluy in China where we have
>> been hearing from the Linux community how Linux loaded laptops are sold
>> very inexpensively.
>> 3. If you violate the terms, Microsoft is entitled to seek compensation.
>>
>> It's all very simple.
>>
>
> But apparently you are demonising the whole of the Chinese people based on
> the alleged behaviour of a few, who are accused by Microsoft (whose honesty
> is, of course, beyond all reproach!) of pirating their crappy software.
> When even you cannot tell us how many people are doing any piracy, no
> legal action in China has been taken by Microsoft against alleged pirates,
> and yet Microsoft takes it upon itself to degrade its poor product to all
> who may pay good money for it based on apparently unsubstantiated
> allegations.
>
> No wonder the Chinese are pissed off.
>
> Yet you maintain that this simply shows what an excellent product Microsoft
> offers.
>
>> If the Chinese people want to take the chance of pirating the software
>> then they have also assume the risk of being caught.
>>
>> They can always use free Linux.
>>
>> But they don't.
>>
>> Why?
>>
>>
>
> You haven't a clue because you don't know the facts yourself, and your
> argument lacks facts.
>
>>>>
>>>>> Does treating poor Chinese users, most of whom have nowhere near the
>>>>> personal wealth of Americans, in such a way constitute respect for the
>>>>> human rights of the Chinese?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> How about the cheap good they dump on the rest of the world?
>>>
>>> And Microsoft?
>>
>> But......... You keep telling me about how expensive Microsoft is and how
>> the Chinese people cannot afford it so they pirate it.
>>
>> See how I am taking you apart?
>>
>>
>>>> How about them playing with their currency?
>>>
>>> And the US doesn't?
>>
>> Not to the extent the Chinese are doing.
>> It's on a massive scale.
>>
>
> The US tobacco industry probably kills more people in places like China than
> anything else.
>
>>>> How about the chemical tainted food, toys etc they export?
>>>>
>>>
>>> And of course the US is totally blameless in all these respects?
>>
>> When the Chinese are doing it to their own people yes.
>> See baby formula for example.
>>
>
> Tobacco.
>
>>
>>>>
>>>> Linux is free.
>>>> They can use Linux if they want.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Yes, and please keep affirming this truth.
>>
>> So why don't they?
>> Exactly what is wrong with Linux that makes people ignore it?
>>
>
> That mere supposition on your part, without any facts.
>
>>
>>>>>> Hey they seem like the perfect people to foist Linux on.
>>>>>
>>>>> Seems to me that the foisting has need done by Microsoft, with their
>>>>> promise of 'Genuine Advantage'. Which, as we know, means advantage to
>>>>> themselves.
>>>>
>>>> Linux is free.
>>>> They can use Linux if they want.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Again, this is so true, that I wonder why you continue to defend
>>> Microsoft.
>>
>> I'm not defending anyone.
>>
>> If Suse Server Linux or whatever their commercial offering was being
>> pirated in China I would defend their right to compensation as well.
>>
>
> But, as I have suggested to you above, there is no evidence apart from
> Microsoft's own untested allegations than any piracy whatever has occurred.
>
> By treating all their actual and potential customers as criminals they are
> shooting themselves in the foot, poor dears.
>
>>
>>>>
>>>>>> Why?
>>>>>> They don't seem to want to obey copyright laws, don't wish to pay for
>>>>>> anything and so forth.
>>>>>
>>>>> Microsoft knew that the Chinese were poor before they started. So why
>>>>> do
>>>>> they now seek to blame the poor for their poverty? And why do they
>>>>> seek to thrust their products on people by using the law?
>>>>
>>>> They seem to be able to afford cars, electronics etc .
>>>>
>>>> Besides:
>>>>
>>>> Linux is free.
>>>> They can use Linux if they want.
>>>>
>>>> Nobody is forcing them to use Microsoft.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Ah, but what if Microsoft have so contrived matters that they don't get
>>> to know about Linux?
>>
>> But....... according to you these people cannot afford Windows and when
>> you are in that position, free looks pretty good.
>>
>> Except when it is free Linux, apparently.
>>
>> Look, firefox is free and people use it.
>> Why?
>> Because it is better than IE.
>>
>>
>>> Isn't that 'forcing?
>>
>> Nope.
>>
>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sounds like the perfect Linux advocate!!
>>>>>
>>>>> No, Microsoft, bless them, are the perfect Linux advocates. The best in
>>>>> the business!
>>>>>
>>>>> Everything they say or do convinces people that Open Source, and in
>>>>> particular Linux, is the way to go.
>>>>
>>>> Yet the Chinese pirate Windows en mass instead of using Linux.
>>>>
>>>> Why is that?
>>>
>>> Why do so many people in the West do the same?
>>
>> Good question.
>> Come up with a solution and you will get rich.
>>
>> I'll get you started, compared to Windows Linux sucks.
>> It really does.
>> It gets better each year, and Microsoft is releasing less than stellar
>> products like Vista which is encouraging those sick of Microsoft to go to
>> Apple.
>>
>> They are certainly not going to desktop Linux.
>>
>
> Linux, as everyone but you knows, runs on more besides trad desktops.
>
>>>>
>>>> Nobody is forcing them top use Microsoft.
>>>>
>>>
>>> See above.
>>
>> Yep.
>>
>>>> Linux is free.
>>>> They can use Linux if they want.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Well done. I think you're getting the message.
>>>
>>> And I think at last we agree:
>>>
>>> Linux is free. We don't have to use Windows. We can use Linux if we want.
>>>
>>> Now let's hear you say this over and over again in future.
>>>
>>> Because even if you don't, Microsoft themselves will continue to piss off
>>> people all over the world and convince them that Open Source, and Linux
>>> in particular, is the way to go.
>>
>> But yet, even in countries where people are poor, they still pirate
>> Windows rather than use Linux.
>>
>
> Only according to Microsoft, who apparently also allege that everyone else
> has been stealing their patents, but refuse to say which.
>
> Simply parroting the Microsoft propaganda on piracy and patents is doing
> Linux good, and helping to destroy Microsoft. So please keep doing it,
> whilst agreeing with me that:
>
> Linux is free, and
>
> People can use Linux if they want, without being accused of piracy.
>
>> That says it all.
>>
>>
>
> I think you said a mouthful.
I can't even find the goal posts after your latest reply.
--
Moshe Goldfarb
Collector of soaps from around the globe.
Please visit The Hall of Linux Idiots:
http://linuxidiots.blogspot.com/
Please Visit www.linsux.org
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