<Quote>
Q: The term browser is a term that is widely used within Microsoft, or
at least was until this year; correct, sir?
MR. HEINER: Objection.
THE WITNESS: We use the term browser, yes.
Q: BY MR. BOIES: And you personally used the term browser, did you
not, sir?
A: Yes, that term is used in quite a variety of ways.
Q: Including by you; correct, sir?
A: Yes.
Q: You've written e-mails about browsers; correct, sir?
A: I've written e-mails where the term browser was used. I wouldn't
say it was necessarily an e-mail about browsers.
Q: Have you ever written an e-mail that you considered to be about
browsers, sir?
A: I'll bet there's e-mail where the primary subject relates to
browsers. I don't remember a specific piece of e-mail.
Q: And when you wrote e-mails using the term browsers, you believed
that people would understand what you meant by browsers; correct, sir?
A: I'm sure there was enough context in the e-mail that I felt I could
communicate something of meaning.
Q: And you've used the term browser in dealing with people outside of
Microsoft, have you not, sir?
A: Yes. It's a term that I've used both internally and externally.
Q: And there are a lot of people outside Microsoft that have written
articles about browsers; correct, sir?
A: There's been articles about browsing and the technology people use
for browsing and comparing the different -- how different companies do
that, and they used the term browser.
Q: Yes. The industry and Microsoft tracks what is referred to as
browser market share; correct sir?
A: No.
End of segment
Q: No? Does Microsoft track browser market share?
A: I've seen usage share.
Q: You've seen usage share?
A: Uh-huh. But not -- market share usually refers to something related
to -- not to usage. And with browsers, I've seen mostly usage. Now,
some people might refer to that as a market share, but it's not a
market share.
Q: What is a market share?
A: Well, when I think of a market share, I think of where you're
comparing the revenue of one company to the revenue of another
company.
Q: The total revenue of a company?
A: No, the revenue related to one company's product to the revenue of
another company's product.
Q: And that's what you think of when you use the term market share; is
that your testimony?
A: Usually.
End of segment
Q: Are you aware of documents within Microsoft that describe browser
share as the company's number one goal?
A: No. I'm aware of documents within Paul Maritz's group that may have
stated that.
Q: Is Paul Maritz's group within Microsoft?
A: Yes, but his -- he doesn't set the company-wide goals.
Q: Mr. Maritz you identified last week as being a group vice-
president; is that correct?
A: Uh-huh. Several times.
Q: And he is the group vice-president with responsibility for Windows;
is that correct?
A: That's among his responsibilities.
Q: And included in his responsibilities was Internet Explorer; is that
correct?
A: Our browsing technology was part of that group.
Q: Was Internet Explorer part of that group?
A: Yes.
Q: Now, did you ever tell Mr. Maritz that browser share was not the
company's number one goal?
A: No.
End of segment
Q: Did you write Gov. Ex. 295 Mr. Gates, on or about January 5, 1996?
A: I don't remember doing so specifically, but it appears that I did.
Q: And the first line of this is, "Winning Internet browser share is a
very very important goal for us." Do you see that?
A: I do.
Q: Do you remember writing that, sir?
A: Not specifically.
Q: Now, when you were referring there to Internet browser share, what
were the companies who were included in that?
A: There's no companies included in that.
Q: Well, if you're winning browser share, that must mean that some
other company is producing browsers and you're comparing your share of
browsers with somebody else's share of browsers; is that not so, sir?
A: You asked me if there are any companies included in that and now --
I'm very confused about what you're asking.
Q: All right, sir, let me see if I can try to clarify. You say here
"Winning Internet browser share is a very very important goal for us."
What companies were supplying browsers whose share you were talking
about?
A: It doesn't appear I'm talking about any other companies in that
sentence.
Q: - Well, sir, is a market share something that is compiled only for
one company? I understand if a company has a monopoly, that may be so,
but in a usual situation where a company does not have a monopoly,
share ordinarily implies comparing how much of a product one company
has with how much of a product another company has; correct?
A: Yes.
Q: Now, when you were talking about Internet browser share here, what
companies were you talking about?
A: You're trying -- you seem to be suggesting that just because share
involves comparing multiple companies, that when I wrote that
sentence, 1 was talking about other companies. It doesn't appear that
I'm talking about other companies in that sentence. I've really read
it very carefully and I don't notice any other companies in there.
Q: Oh, you mean you don't see any other company mentioned in that
sentence; is that what you're saying?
A: The sentence doesn't appear to directly or indirectly refer to any
other companies.
Q: When you refer to an Internet browser share here, sir, what is the
share of?
A: Browser usage.
Q: Of course, you don't say "browser usage" here, do you, sir?
A: No, it says "share."
Q: Now, let's say that you meant browser usage because that's what
your testimony is. What browser usage were you talking about in terms
of what your share of browser usage was? What browsers?
A: I'm not getting your question. Are you trying to ask what I was
thinking when I wrote this sentence?
Q: Let me begin with that. What were you thinking when you -
A: I don't remember specifically writing this sentence.
Q: Does that mean you can't answer what you were thinking when you
wrote the sentence?
A: That's correct.
Q: So since you don't have an answer to that question, let me put a
different question.
A: I have an answer. The answer is I don't remember.
Q: You don't remember what you meant. Let me try to ask you -
A: I don't remember what I was thinking.
Q: Is there a difference between remembering what you were thinking
and remembering what you meant?
A: If the question is what I meant when I wrote it, no.
Q: So you don't remember what you were thinking when you wrote it and
you don't remember what you meant when you wrote it; is that fair?
A: As well as not remember writing it.
Q: Okay. Now, let me go on to another paragraph and see whether you
remember writing that or not. And that is the second paragraph, which
reads, "Apparently a lot of OEMs are bundling non-Microsoft browsers
and coming up with offerings together with Internet Service providers
that get displayed on their machines in a FAR" and you've capitalized
each of the letters in far "more prominent way than MSN or our
Internet browser." Do you see that?
A: Uh-huh.
Q: Did you write that sentence, Mr. Gates?
A: I don't remember, but I have no reason to doubt that I did.
Q: Do you remember what you were thinking when you wrote that sentence
or what you meant when you wrote that sentence?
A: No.
Q: Do you remember that in January, 1996, a lot of OEMs were bundling
non-Microsoft browsers?
A: I'm not sure.
Q: What were the non-Microsoft browsers that you were concerned about
in January of 1996?
A: What's the question? You're trying to get me to recall what other
browsers I was thinking about when I wrote that sentence?
Q: No, because you've told me that you don't know what you were
thinking about when you wrote that sentence.
A: Right.
Q: What I'm trying to do is get you to tell me what non-Microsoft
browsers you were concerned about in January of 1996. If it had been
only one, I probably would have used the name of it. Instead I seem to
be using the term non-Microsoft browsers.
Q: My question is what non-Microsoft browsers were you concerned about
in January of 1996?
A: I'm sure -- what's the question? Is it -- are you asking me about
when I wrote this e-mail or what are you asking me about?
Q: I'm asking you about January of 1996.
A: That month?
Q: Yes, sir.
A: And what about it?
Q: What non-Microsoft browsers were you concerned about in January of
1996?
A: I don't know what you mean "concerned."
Q: What is it about the word "concerned" that you don't understand?
A: I'm not sure what you mean by it.
End of segment
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http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/business/longterm/microsoft/documents/gatespart5.htm
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