__/ [ BT ] on Monday 25 September 2006 10:20 \__
>
> "Roy Schestowitz" <newsgroups@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
> news:3122272.lmm0uXzMdx@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> __/ [ BT ] on Sunday 24 September 2006 21:46 \__
>>
>> >
>> > "Roy Schestowitz" <newsgroups@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
>> > news:1714044.UYhfc1BRWo@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> >> __/ [ BT ] on Sunday 24 September 2006 18:55 \__
>> >>
>> >> > "Roy Schestowitz" <newsgroups@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
>> >> > news:1356404.JHbyR2ov5B@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> >> >> __/ [ Paul ] on Saturday 23 September 2006 12:13 \__
>> >> >>
>> >> >> > On Sat, 23 Sep 2006 12:08:37 +0100, Roy Schestowitz
>> >> >> > <newsgroups@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >>Could sniff user-agent and deliver different content
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > Doesn't that come under black hat ?
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Maybe for the Web site (well, it's the Webmaster that risks
>> > banishment),
>> >> > but
>> >> >> not for the surfer. I make special efforts to never report my
> browser
>> > type
>> >> >> and O/S properly because there is too much discrimination and poor
>> >> >> development on the Web. Not to mention privacy invasion (e.g. Google
>> >> >> Analytics, which is a good reason to disable scripts). If a site is
>> >> > behaving
>> >> >> badly, I wish to be denied access and move on to more interesting
>> >> > content --
>> >> >> that which is managed by content creators that are better informed.
>> >> > *smile*
>> >> >
>> >> > Hi
>> >> > I was considering using G Analytics on my site , what's wrong with it
> ?
>> >>
>> >> In short, it is more intrusive than standard usual usage logs. It uses
> the
>> >> full capacity available that is available with JavaScript to gather a
> lot
>> > of
>> >> details. Then, the data is taken off-server (cross-site scripting) to
>> > reside
>> >> in Google's datacentre. Google is notorious for never flushing its
> data.
>> > It
>> >> guards it like a hawk, hoping that it would be handy one day (e.g.
> Google
>> >> Suggest and Google Trends). That's where all the 'fun' begins.
>> >>
>> >> Now, you see, the governments have got access to your surfing habits,
> as
>> > well
>> >> as plenty of other interesting information (e.g. screen resolution). If
>> > many
>> >> sites adopt Google Analytics and surfer naively let the XSS be run,
> then
>> > the
>> >> nanny country/company risk becomes a reality. If you look at some
>> > mainstream
>> >> news Web sites, you will find that they XSS with many sites that gather
>> > all
>> >> sorts of details about you, probably creating a profile. How that data
>> > gets
>> >> sold and exchanged, who knows? Be sure, it does. There's a whole
> industry
>> >> behind it. Let the server that you visit record your IP, request, etc.
>> > Don't
>> >> broadcast your cyberspace life to the entire world (think about AOL
> logs
>> >> that got leaked). Wait a few years and you'll see what happens. Don't
> be
>> >> part of that game either, by sending information about your valued
>> >> visitors/customers to third parties.
>> >>
>> >> Recent example: a Chinese man has just sued Yahoo. Why? Because Yahoo
> made
>> >> his E-mails available to the government, which had him jailed. You
> think
>> >> that's bad? We have only gotten started... and Yahoo showed little or
> no
>> >> regrets when facing a Federal court hearing (where _all_ major search
>> >> engines were harshly accused and criticised).
>> >>
>> >> Best wishes,
>> >>
>> >> Roy
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >
>> > So, what do you suggest , not to use it at all? Use my host company logs
>> > and stats instead ? With it I can't have so much good info on visitors.
>> > What about Statcounter? Any better?
>> > What are your suggestions in hiding my personal "surfing" and protection
> of
>> > the compay web site logs?
>> > Thanks
>>
>> I personally use AWStats. It gives all the stuff I would bother checking
> in
>> the morning (no more than one minute) and a lot beyond this. Analytics
>> (Urchin) is good if you do SEM and need to investigate routes of
> navigation
>> using pertinent statistics.
>>
>
>
> Yes, I will do SEM and SEO, also have seen that G Analytics can be
> "integrated" with AdWords which I'm planning to start. I'm trying to see
> how much they got traffic from where and what's the value for money
> invested in AdWords returned (ROI) .
> AWStats looks nice even got some things G Analytics hasn't (spider visits,
> worms...)
> It goes on web server, right?
It could, but it doesn't have to. Remember that the logs are the equivalent
of milk, where you can make cheese, or cream, or whatever you desire from
it. The fine products just require that you keep all the raw material (logs)
on your server and/or PC.
You can run awstats as a (possibly repetitive) job or the server or
periodically do this locally (just point it to the log file/s). I also use
Visitors 0.6, which a friend once recommended. It gives more detailed
statistics, but probably too much information to digest. All of these are of
course free and you could, in principle, modify them to suit your needs
better (and potentially redistribute, I suspect... if the licences permit).
Although I have Webalizer and another stats package on my server, I don't
find them helpful. Think which stats you would like to have access to, as
well as be able to afford the time interpreting. I spend one minute at most,
per day. Remember that, in a nutshell, stats are deceitful. Even once read,
it is not obvious how to use them and improve. So follow some common sense
and intuition rather than over-thinking, over-complicating, and quantifying
something as fluid as design. And be cautious about monitoring your visitors
with JS every 5 seconds and sedning that data over to several datacentres
worldwide.
Ultimately, when people disable scripts (or bacllist Google Analytics), your
stats will give you a lacking picture.
Best wishes,
Roy
--
Roy S. Schestowitz
http://Schestowitz.com | SuSE GNU/Linux ¦ PGP-Key: 0x74572E8E
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